This makes me sad. Thank you for writing it. I don’t feel like there is any space for me, as much as I am here living on this earth. I feel forgotten and invisible. I hope that one day there will be space for me. Exactly as I am or however I end up in the future which will probably be alone.
I am a long time follower but have just subscribed to the email and request pending on the Facebook group. Can’t wait to get more involved in the community - a step to feeling less invisible :)
Thank you so much for sharing your feelings. I share many parallels with you - I would love to be a mother, but I am single so it hasn’t happened for me yet. Some of the stupidest decisions in dating that I have made over the years (accepting poor treatment etc) is down to ‘how will I have a baby?’ I have now stopped looking for someone else to give me what I want, I am now saving and planning to actively pursue solo parenthood via IVF. But even then, it is no guarantee of motherhood. IVF is no given. I share many of your feelings - I feel invisible as a single, childless woman whilst mothers seem to be celebrated everywhere. The endless complaining about how hard motherhood is (however true), may be designed to make us feel better about our childless state, but it does the opposite and makes me feel more isolated.
Isabel, thank you so much for your lovely comment. I'm so glad it resonated with you. That's also the part I find the most isolating. For some reason mums celebrating and sharing their joy doesn't bother me as much. I am also saving to do the same by the way. I hope it works out for both of us xx
Thanks for opening up this topic Nicola, I love and admire your openness and honesty. YES pls let’s build a bridge and support each other wherever you find yourself. As you know I’m a Christian and one of my favourite scriptures in the Bible is Romans 12:15 which reads: “Be happy with those who are happy, and weep with those who weep.” It’s a hard call to put aside our own immediate feelings to be empathetic to another but it’s also a key part - in my opinion - of being human. I had an abortion when I was 18 and then lost my daughter to early infant death when I was married a few years later. It took me ages to even look at another baby but the healing began when a toddler thrust her arms out at me so I had no choice but to carry her. Like you, babies and young children melt my heart. Now that I’m divorced and single again I’ve taken children out of the equation but him grateful that I feel okay about that because I know that feeling of want is realllllly f-cking hard. I pray for people who want to be pregnant and I pray for people who have experienced baby loss like me. It feels like a gift to be in this place of healing.
Ah Tola! Thanks so much for your lovely comment! You are amazing. I meant to say your newsletter on abortion was really good - so honest and a really important topic. Thanks so much for your kind words. I'm so glad you are in a place of healing. You deserve it! I owe you an email by the way xxx
Mar 21, 2023·edited Mar 21, 2023Liked by Nicola Slawson
It always hits me when reading articles people write about their lives, experiences and feelings, then reading the comments these articles generate, that the shared thread is often that at times there is a feeling of being misunderstood, alone, invisible or overlooked. Maybe that could be the beginning of the bridge? The realisation that despite how varied and different our lives, experiences and feelings are, that within those, nearly all of us will have felt misunderstood, alone, invisible or overlooked somehow. That the anger, sadness/pain, shame/guilt and contradictory emotions we can all have, regardless of what our lives look like to the outside world/others, are natural and we should try to understand that more. Not just understand the people with whom we share some identified similarities with, but also those whose lives look totally different to ours, but who still have those feelings about their situations etc?
Just think there are the childless by choice, those who wanted children but couldn't,
those who had children who died, women who were pregnant but lost the baby, those who had abortions, those who gave children away for adoption, or had their children removed by Authorities. Grandparents, other relatives or friends of the parents raising children. There are only children or multiple children in a home, single mothers, same sex couples raising children, married parents, divorced parents, step parents, surrogate mothers, adoptive parents, foster parents and of course parents who don't want to be! There are parents with disabilities raising children without disabilities, or parents who have children with disabilities who do not have disabilities themselves. There are couples parenting children who are mixed heritage either together or alone, with either disapproval from the other's family due to ethnicity difference or with support.
There are so many 'parenting' roles, biological or otherwise. Professionally there are jobs where you can take on a role where you care very much like a parent does.
Each unique experience comes with those feelings of being misunderstood, alone, being invisible or overlooked. All are different, none are better.
I love this: "The realisation that despite how varied and different our lives, experiences and feelings are, that within those, nearly all of us will have felt misunderstood, alone, invisible or overlooked somehow. That the anger, sadness/pain, shame/guilt and contradictory emotions we can all have, regardless of what our lives look like to the outside world/others, are natural and we should try to understand that more."
I so agree! Thanks again for taking the time to comment. xxx
I agree most of society feel misunderstood, isolated, alone, invisible or overlooked at some point in our lives, so that is a great starting point. Yet there seems to be low understanding and empathy around being without child for both men and women for whatever reason in comparison to other circumstances that cause a grief response. There is a proactive outpouring of sympathy to the loss of .... yet those without child grieve alone ashamed somehow of their failure to fulfil the role of mother/father with the added expectation that they had a choice to adopt, IVF, surrogacy etc so the blame lays at our door. How can we expect understanding when there is no societally defined pain point that evokes an outpouring of support for our grief?
Thanks for this Nicola, great writing and i realted to it as someone who sits somewhere between childfree and childless, so in a different space to you. Not sure if that will change.
I find there's so many grey areas of feelings in an issue that is often painted as black and white. Some other weird trigger points I've come across in my journey with this:
- I feel like there is an implication if you don't have kids your career better be absolutely stellar to have any value as a single childless woman. My job is good and I value it, but I find more value in my hobbies and friendships.
- As IVF single motherhood had become more slightly common (and absolutely hooray for this for those people who want to do it) there's also a little bit of judgement if that's NOT your choice if you technically COULD do it, albeit with much sacrifice. I just resent being told to take this path by people with twice the income and more resources than me, like it's like it's an easy solution or decision.
Thanks so much for sharing this! I love what you have said about your career and how actually your hobbies and friendships are what you value the most. I've been writing something recently about being called a career woman and this has just made me think about how it's also the pressure, like you say, to have a stellar one! Thank you for raising such a good point.
Also, I totally hear you on the solo motherhood journey. It really isn't for everyone and is so so so expensive. If it was easy / cheap, I would have done it years ago as for me I can see myself doing it... but it's neither so I have just been hoping to find a way. It is really annoying when people just say "go for it" without appreciating the scale of the financial implications etc. Also some people simply don't want to as they only want kids if they can do it with a partner which is also more than fair enough!
It's exhausting being a woman isn't it! It just feels like you can't win. Love both Clover Stroud and Elizabeth Day - both experiences totally valid and worthy of attention. But given that motherhood is still seen as the 'default', I still feel that single and childless women (whether by choice or not) are really stigmatised and excluded. I feel that Elizabeth really encapsulated the lack of empathy so many people have for something which for them, may have been relatively easy. I feel that all the time I am expected to be constantly empathetic to the struggles and experiences of friends who are partnered, but that same empathy is never available or reciprocated back to me, for what I may be struggling with. If it is, it's done in quite a dismissive, almost exasperated way. I wish more people could understand how it feels to not get the societal validation of hitting these milestones. It's obviously infuriating that men aren't treated the same way, or subject to such judgement! For what it's worth, I really recommend the book Between Women: Love, Envy, and Competition in Women's Friendships by psychologist Susie Orbach - the conclusion is that women really need each other, regardless of whether they are mothers or not!
Oooh that book sounds amazing. I am collecting non-fiction books about friendship at the moment. Thanks so much for your lovely comment and yes it really is exhausting! I totally relate on feeling like people are exasperated with me over things I struggle with! Thanks again Charlie xx
Woah! Sorry didn’t expect that to be so long! Guess this is a matter closer to my heart than I realised! But basically, yes to women supporting women. Hands down the best way forward 🙏🏾🫶🏾💪🏾 xx
I’m 43 and have/ am coming to terms with the fact that the having children ship has sailed without me.
It was hard enough for years being the only single one amongst friendship groups, but being the only one who is single AND childless for the last 5-10 years has been pretty isolating. Being made to feel by some people as inadequate because of the fact that your life hasn’t followed the “traditional” path of find boyfriend, get married, have kids is hard.
Even though close friends try to be sympathetic, I don’t think they understand how hard it is that I’ll never be a mother - because they all are. It probably doesn’t help that I’ve made light over the years of how I feel because 1) no one wants to spend time with a whiner who makes them feel bad that they have kids, and 2) I also don’t want people pitying me.
It’s a tough situation and maybe I need to spend more time making friends who are in similar situation.
Thanks so much for the comment, Louise. I'm so sorry you have had to come to terms with that. That's so hard – and you're right being the only one who is both single and childless can be so isolating.
I so relate to what you said about making light of the situation. I definitely used to do that a lot. I've actually had quite a few messages from people I know who have said they had no idea I wanted to be a mum, which goes to show how good I used to be at masking. It's only really in the last two years that I've taken the mask off but like you I also still make light of it often for fear of no-one wanting to hang out with me.
Nicola, what a powerful read. Thank you for sharing so honestly. I don't feel entitled to comment on the experiences of childless women, whether by choice or not, because I do have children. In this space, that feels like a confession. I agree with you and Elizabeth Day in that that surely, like anything else, really *really* listening to each other is the way to bridge any gap? And caring deeply about the experiences of our friends, whether they are feeling joyful, deep in grief, envious, or whatever. I hope to be that kind of friend - indeed I hope I AM that kind of friend.
From my perspective, I have been told not to breastfeed in public in case it might upset a bystander who doesn't have children. I've been deliberately excluded from a birthday dinner for a friend, because they assumed I wouldn't be able to find a babysitter. I don't share celebrations of motherhood on my social media, but I agree with you that I don't think this is akin to showing off a fancy car. This is my life, my family, and I feel I should be able to choose to share some of it.
I do understand the other point of view and I have been in that position - unceremoniously handed a newborn three days after a miscarriage, and ushered upstairs to read bedtime stories to children when I was quite enjoying being childless and drinking wine with the adults. It's such a difficult subject to tackle but I think communication is key. Anyone who doesn't want to listen to your point of view, whatever it is, is not worth the time. x
You are definitely welcome to comment! I actually meant to put a note asking both mothers and childless women to comment.
I once didn't invite my friend with a five month old baby to the pub. I'd just assumed she would say no and that it would be annoying to be asked ("of course I can't come, I've got a new born, I imagined she would say). But she messaged the next day saying she was hurt to be left out and so I realised I should never assume. It was a big lesson for me although sometimes when I have invited mums to things they have responded with exasperation at being asked! I guess it goes back to everyone being different.
I'm sorry about the breastfeeding in public. That's so shocking! And about the miscarriage. I'm so sorry you went through that and were treated insensitively afterwards. Sending love xx
Anyway thanks so much for your thoughtful message. I really appreciate you joining the conversation.
What a well-written, thought-provoking article! Thank you, Nicola. We finally accepted I could not have children when partway through IVF my hormones dropped to a level which meant my reproductive system was no longer viable. After 16 operations for endometriosis my body could not take any more.
For years I had cooed over everyone's babies, played with toddlers, helped kids of friends with their homework - partly out of love and partly out of a need for that kind of connection, always anticipating. When I found out I could not have babies in any way naturally it was like a switch flipped. Every time a friend shared the wonderful news of their babies-to-be I smiled and hugged them, then cried for days at the unfairness of it all. It hurt SO much.
I withdrew from spending time off my own initiative with small people. It felt like sticking pins in my heart. And it wasn't healthy. I love all the kids I have known for decades (no longer kids, obviously) and would literally give a kidney for them. But now I steer clear of most children, apart from two gorgeous redheads to whom I am godparent. With them I have a place. A function. A purpose.
The next stage I dread is when the friends I socialise become grandparents and I feel excluded again. I'm trying not to think of that.
Oh Lisa. Thanks so much for sharing this with me. I'm so sorry you have been through all this.
And thanks for sharing how it's been to be around babies and small children. That sounds so tough. It really is so unfair. But putting those boundaries in place and taking care of your own needs was obviously the right thing to do. I love what you said about your godsons giving you a place, a function and a purpose when it comes to kids.
Have you heard of Gateway Women? Jody Day is the founder and she's also written a book about living a fulfilled life after coming to the same conclusion you did. I interviewed her recently and she was brilliant. Some of what you have said reminds me of how she felt and feels.
I'm glad you're using your platform to highlight this. Disability is another angle to this which is seldom explored. Substack just ate my entire attempt at a comment, so let's try again:
I personally feel ambivalently childless. I was always afraid of pregnancy and labour, and as my multiple serious chronic conditions developed through my teens, I could see how a pregnancy might destabilise my health, and that having little social or financial support would make motherhood harder given my relapsing/remitting illness. I believed I wouldn't be allowed to adopt.
I sum it up as "I would have liked to have had a genuine choice." In an ableist world where we face all sorts of extra structural inequalities, you can easily wind up adapting your appetite to life for the scraps available, and only in middle age have I been able to see how damaging that has been for me. Nobody back then was teaching me about disability justice or intersectional feminism.
Society's largely unexamined ableism shapes perceptions of our bodies and lives. Either we are seen as needing to make up for our supposed deficits by reproducing, or we face shaming, disapproval and concern-trolling for wanting to - including sometimes by doctors.
If you're autistic the knives are out for you either way. Childless? You risk vicious attacks if you speak up about the needs and experiences of autistic children (which you "know nothing about" despite having BEEN one). The mother of an also autistic child? You risk hostility when you advocate for them in medical and educational settings, because the very source of your deep insight into their experience gives authorities permission to dismiss you.
The fear of disabled bodies is immense at the best of times, and the cycle of austerity, pandemic and now more welfare reforms shows that disabled lives are still considered disposable. In that context, disabled motherhood and disabled childlessness are both intensely political, routinely invisible, and in conversations like this one, often forgotten altogether.
Thanks so much for this thoughtful and interesting response. You are right about disability being another angle that's ignored. I should have mentioned disability in my piece. I'll make sure I include some links to articles when I get round to doing a follow up. I can also commission a disabled writer to do a guest piece for me.
This paragraph stood out as I've been thinking about this lately: "Society's largely unexamined ableism shapes perceptions of our bodies and lives. Either we are seen as needing to make up for our supposed deficits by reproducing, or we face shaming, disapproval and concern-trolling for wanting to - including sometimes by doctors."
I follow a woman on Instagram who is disabled and uses a wheelchair. She recently gave birth to a baby but while pregnant, she faced so many insensitive questions and so much judgement and so much shaming. The baby is healthy and things went smoothly but it hasn't stopped the naysayers. But despite this I can see how much it has meant to people to see her share her experience honestly because we don't usually see that representation. Hopefully it will help people confront some of their own biases. Obviously the trolls are too far gone.
Anyway thanks again for taking the time to write. Xxx
People often want to watch us do amazing feats and come away thinking, "Well, if she can climb a mountain with multiple disabilities, I can get that promotion this year," - or whatever goal you're having doubts or impostor syndrome about.
But when we invite others into our normal, like being a disabled mum, it can provoke unease because it takes us off the inspo pedestal. And all that inspo hasn't prepared anyone to examine structural or personal ableism, which then gets couched as concern for the child. I think you can cop a lot of flak when you're the first disabled mum people are aware of having encounered.
But she and people like Jessica Kellgren-Fozard and Hannah Witton are doing an enormous amount to shift the ground on this topic - just seeing Jessica discuss adaptive childcare as a Deaf (and gay) mum with disabilities affecting fatigue, pain and muscle tone, or Hannah talking about how pregnancy changed her experiences with her stoma, is widening the conversation in ways it's really needed, and I'm so glad to hear you're also interested in platforming disabled writers on this topic.
Thanks for a really interesting and valuable conversation!
Thanks for writing this. It articulates many of my feelings so well! I’d love to be a mother and had just started exploring options for single women when I got me/cfs. Not being able to work and the prospect of a precarious life on inadequate income support is bleak, but not as heart breaking as how less likely it now is that I’ll ever have a baby. I nearly cried at lunch for my sister’s birthday yesterday when a waitress asked if I wanted to see the kids menu, as if one of the kids were mine. Big love to anyone struggling with motherhood or it’s lack.
Dear Nicola, I am responding from the permanently childless perspective. I am somewhere in between childless by choice and not by choice, i.e. I identify as ambivalently childless. I hear you that you wish you were ambivalent! I am 46, have been single for over ten years, and this is pretty much why I'm childless. I don't expect that to change and am trying to make peace with it.
I liked so many things about this piece. I really wanted to post it on Lighthouse Women, an international community of childless women I'm sure you're familiar with. But I won't post it there (maybe someone else will) because I find a couple of aspects of what you wrote insensitive to the permanently childless experience.
I know that when it comes to parenthood, you still identify as hopeful. You don't identify as permanently childless like I (and all Lighthouse Women) do; you are still in the unknown of whether you will or won't be a parent. I am mentioning this because when I was still in the unknown, I also didn't mind being around other people's children or seeing people celebrate mother's day. I was still hopeful that I might one day join the ranks of parents with children; other people's babies and mother's day celebrations reminded me of what was hopefully in my future.
This all changed when I became permanently childless. It was about two years ago; I was almost 45 and realized with sudden clarity that it just wasn't going to happen. There was some relief in finally knowing. And it also really changed how I felt about being around moms and children (particularly strangers) and mother's day celebrations. I still love babies, though I haven't held one since I became childless, but I am now happiest when I am not confronted with moms and babies because they fill me with mostly shame and also some pain. And I am ambivalently childless - I know that the pain is much more severe for those who are unequivocally childless not by choice.
So here is what made me protest on the inside while reading your piece and compelled me to respond for the first time after having been reading The Single Supplement for over a year:
"But as I said I didn’t see trigger warnings or apologies – and women really shouldn’t have to feel the need to apologies for celebrating motherhood. That, I feel, is totally unnecessary." I agree with you that no one should have to apologize for celebrating mother's day. And I think trigger warnings and opt-outs are absolutely essential for those grieving their childlessness. More and more companies are offering opt-outs from mother's day mailings. Mother's day can be excruciatingly painful for those who wanted to be mothers but aren't and won't be. I feel protective of these women when I see you defending mothers' rights to amplify themselves on mother's day. I really don't want to contribute to the "us vs them" mentality you speak to. And yet--and this brings me to my second point..
You ask: "Couldn’t we build a bridge and focus on what we do have in common and focus on the ways in which we could hold space for both experiences?" That sounds great. I would love that. And yet, the space for the motherhood experience already exists. It is literally everywhere. You are right that mothers are not invisible - childless women are. Mothers are in the majority; childless women are a minority, a marginalized community. Just look at any contemporary TV show: All the supposedly relatable female characters over 40 are parents. It is the space for the childless experience that still needs to be created. So it feels a little unfair that you are holding all women equally responsible for creating equity when we are not currently seen or treated as equals.
Thanks so much for your thoughtful response and so sorry you found my writing insensitive. I should have mentioned people who are permanently childless. That was an oversight, which was perhaps down to the fact I sometimes find it a difficult idea to confront as I know it could be my future and I'm not ready to give up hope yet. Perhaps I can commission a writer who is permanently childless – and also single – to do a guest piece from this perspective.
I'm sorry to hear you don't want to be around mothers and babies. I can understand that but I wasn't saying that Elizabeth or anyone who feels this way was wrong. I was just sharing my own perspective so I don't think that was actually insensitive? It's just how I feel not a judgement.
I take your point about trigger warnings, obviously everyone is different. I can edit in and add a line to say that but just to be clear when I was talking about trigger warnings, I wasn't talking about businesses and companies. I was talking about individual mums doing trigger warnings on their own Mother's Day posts. Perhaps I should make that clearer. I think the opt out option for emails etc is really good and I have friends who use it because they have lost one or both parent.
I understand on your last point. I didn't think of it like that at all but you make a great point. Thanks for sharing. Sorry again you felt it was insensitive xx
Hi Nicola, it is late and I will write more tomorrow. I just wanted to say that I found most of this article very sensitive! You bring up some really important and valid points that make me feel seen as a single and as a childless woman. Thank you for acknowledging also that you may have a blind spot around the permanently childless experience. It is scary to include it in one’s vision and I avoided it for a long time until I felt I couldn’t anymore. Time for sleep - more tomorrow. Thank you for being willing to be in dialog!
Hello again, I'm back. I wanted to respond to some of your positions.
1) Whether you suggested that the way Elizabeth (ED) feels is wrong: You definitely didn't say that explicitly. And the direct contrast of your feelings about holding babies with hers comes across as a subtle judgment or at least a lack of understanding for her. It sounded a bit like you were saying "what's the big deal; babies are great." What would have been more sensitive in my opinion is some understanding and empathy that permanently childless women in the depth of grief might feel uncomfortable around or might want to avoid moms and babies. I get where ED is coming from. Many people don't though, and so I will fill in the gap by normalizing this phenomenon: It is very common and understandable for childless women to need to set boundaries around moms and / or children for a time, and this phase can last months or even years. It doesn't constitute a moral failing on their part or mean that they are intolerant or unkind. I know that you didn't suggest any such thing but it felt important to me to emphasize this anyway because people might be tempted to judge childless women who need to protect themselves in this way as bitter or any other unflattering designations.
2) Mother's Day messages by companies vs individuals: It kind of felt like you were saying that it was a good thing that you didn't come across any apologies or trigger warnings on Mother's Day. To me, apologies isn't actually the right word because no one did anything wrong by having a baby. Acknowledgments feels more fitting. I agree that individual moms don't need to issue acknowledgments or trigger warnings on Mother's Day. But if they do, you bet that I and many other childless women will appreciate it. To me, it's an act of kindness and inclusion of childless women to acknowledge that Mother's Day might be an excruciating day of grief for some. Your message to moms seems to be "Don't worry about childless women on mother's day." I'm not saying that they need to (think of us) but you saying that they shouldn't feels insensitive to me. We're already excluded and invisibilized enough because moms are seen as more important and worthy of attention and space every other day of the year as well.
3) About my last point: It seems like you get it already but I wanted to share a little more. When I read ED's piece as a permanently childless woman, my response was a resounding YES. I don't share all of her experiences or perspectives but I felt supported in everything she said. I know that in your piece you tried to be neutral and inclusive of both mothers as well as childless women. Given that parenthood is the societal default and childlessness is seen as "other", i.e. parents are in the majority whereas childless women are a minority, I don't even know what neutrality would look like. And I am definitely sensing some subtle bias from you by way of privileging the comfort of mothers over that of childless women. If you are still hopeful of one day joining the mom club, it makes all kinds of sense. When I was still hopeful, I tried to ingratiate myself to moms, trying to be seen as "right" and "good" by them, as mom material, if you will. Now that I know for sure that I will never be part of the club, I am much less inclined to try to ingratiate myself or to be as polite as I once was, and the same seems to be true for ED. You could say that we are being harsh or abrasive or too loud but I just don't really see a lot of moms putting as much emotional labor into their relationships with childless women as vice versa. And this is why the process of building the bridge you are envisioning--which I would also love to see--is currently out of balance and one-sided.
All of this being said, I have so much empathy for your howamigoingtohaveababy soundtrack and the associated fear and panic. I admire you for speaking so openly about your hopes and pains. I get that no one wants to be a member of the childless-not-by-choice club. And this is exactly why permanently childless women often aren't treated very well - we remind people of what they don't want to be.
Thanks Vera. I appreciate your point of view although I don't agree with everything you have said and I think in some cases you are ignoring things I have actually said and reading lots of things into it that I don't actually think, which feels a bit unfair.
1) Me pointing out how I feel compared to ED was in no way a judgement at all. That didn't cross my mind for an instant. I was actually really moved by what she said and I know people who feel exactly like that. I was just trying to point out that everyone is different and everyone reacts differently. I used the word "movingly" and then I later said "But I haven’t been through a miscarriage or failed IVF so maybe it’s different for me. I know plenty of women who really struggle with being around pregnant women and babies and who dread being invited to baby showers. And they are also the ones to find Mother’s Day particularly challenging." I'm not sure what else I could have said here aside from not sharing my own experience. But this newsletter is based on my own personal stories – and lots of people have mentioned to me that they are the same as me around babies including some permanently childless (see Tola's message below).
2) I talk about acknowledgments and how much I appreciated them on Mother's Day. "What I had seen were some people choosing to add a little thoughtful note to say they were thinking of those struggling. I appreciated these little notes and didn’t think they took away from the celebration." and "I guess that is why when people have put a little note under posts about Mother’s Day to say they are thinking of those who are struggling, I have felt touched." What I said about Trigger Warnings and apologies was in direct response to Clover's post and all the comments underneath. I felt that doing a big post about trigger warnings was unnecessary as I didn't see any. That is what I meant by that. Again I was talking about individual mothers not businesses and I was talking about I had personally seen and my thoughts on what Clover's post said. You are also saying you appreciate acknowledgments so we literally are saying the same thing here. And on actual TW, I am also allowed my own opinion on them. It doesn't take away from anyone else having an opinion. I was writing from my own perspective.
3) The other point, I do understand and you have given me food for thought but I do think you're expecting an awful lot from me given it's my first contribution on the topic and I was sharing my opinion on what could help rather than proposing a detailed plan of what it could work... Also on this part - "And I am definitely sensing some subtle bias from you by way of privileging the comfort of mothers over that of childless women" – It's true, I didn't want to alienate anyone and that does include mothers but it was more because I know people just switch off if they feel like they are being shamed and I wanted to show empathy to them in much the same way as I was asking for it for women without kids. Maybe I am biased for the reasons you say but I did also say right at the top of the article that I was writing it from my perspective as a woman who wants a child and doesn't have one yet. I wasn't writing a balanced piece of journalism. It's a personal essay and it's my reality now. I can't pretend to be someone I'm not in order to keep everyone reading my work happy. Besides I've been contacted by other permanently childless women on Twitter and Instagram and it's clear that everyone feels differently so it would be impossible. But I do totally get and understand your point about the minority vs majority and how imbalanced that is and how it should be more on the heads of mothers. I wasn't claiming to be able to solve the problem though, I just wanted to start a dialogue and to try and get mums reading this to understand my position because a lot of them, as you know, do not really stop and think about it.
Thanks though for taking the time to write to me. I do appreciate your point of view and perspective and I will commission a writer to do something for the newsletter on the perspective of being permanently childless as soon as I can. Thanks again for your thoughts. Xx
Hi Nicola, I'm glad to hear that you aren't judging ED. I must have misunderstood.
Again, I appreciated so much of what you wrote here. Maybe I could have highlighted some of those aspects more. Here is just one example: "I once read somewhere that the only thing more exhausting than having children is not having children and wanting them." I think I have read that somewhere before as well, and it really resonates.
You are right that you cannot be someone you're not. I apologize if it seems like I am asking you to be someone else. My intention was to educate but it seems that I have put you on the defensive. I will back off now and look forward to reading more of your writing on the topic of childlessness.
Sorry Vera. I didn't mean to be defensive. I am just tired as I've have been replying to people all day on social media and via email. But I have just edited the piece and included a video by Jody Day, who I recently interviewed and a few other clarifications. Thanks again. xx
Mar 22, 2023·edited Mar 22, 2023Liked by Nicola Slawson
Hi Nicola, I hear you about being exhausted. It sounds like you really struck a chord! From what I can see on Substack, you got very positive responses. I hope you didn't get too many challenging responses elsewhere. I apologize if I was too hard on you. I have really enjoyed your contributions to the single space, and I knew that due to long-term singlehood you had lived experience of being othered and sidelined, so I was hoping you would be able to understand what I was saying. And it sounds like you did! I'm just sorry if I hurt you in the process - I really didn't meant to. I also realize now that there were at least two misunderstandings on my part:
1) I didn't realize that you were talking about the relationship between moms and temporarily childless women, i.e. potential future moms. It makes sense though since that's your identity. When you say "childless woman" you mean "still hopeful childless woman." When I read "childless woman" I think "permanently childless woman" because that's my identity now. So that's where my field of vision is limited and our wires got crossed a bit.
2) Even though I am familiar with your newsletter, I perhaps took this recent one to be more political than you meant it. And so I wanted it to be more politically correct, if you will. Even though I do believe that the personal is political, I understand now that in your writing you were speaking from your own personal experience and didn't really intend to speak for everyone, and certainly not all permanently childless women. And so again, our wires got crossed a bit, and I take responsibility for that.
I really do appreciate you making that edit though to include the permanently childless experience and the link to the video. And I am excited about your unpublished project involving Jody Day!
Yes! This! This was a beautiful read. I’ve never had even an inkling of desire to be a mother…until I met my current partner. Had we come together 10 years ago, I think we would have had children. (There is still a huge part of me that very much does not want to be a mother) It is not in the cards for us and I’m at peace with it.
It’s so disheartening the way women are pitted against one another based on our personal choices and our ability to reproduce. To me, being a mother is a sacred journey that I have the utmost respect for AND it doesn’t make you more worthy than someone who has made a different choice. I don’t feel less than for not choosing motherhood. Women who experience life without children have an enormous amount to offer the world, each other, and ourselves.
I’m very grateful that I have a wonderful mix of girlfriends who are both mothers and not mothers. We support one another and hold space for each of our unique choices/experiences in life. My hope is that more women experience this kind of acceptance and celebration of our personal choices.
This makes me sad. Thank you for writing it. I don’t feel like there is any space for me, as much as I am here living on this earth. I feel forgotten and invisible. I hope that one day there will be space for me. Exactly as I am or however I end up in the future which will probably be alone.
Sorry it made you sad Rach! I hope there will be space for you too. Sending you so much love xxx
I am a long time follower but have just subscribed to the email and request pending on the Facebook group. Can’t wait to get more involved in the community - a step to feeling less invisible :)
Thank you so much for sharing your feelings. I share many parallels with you - I would love to be a mother, but I am single so it hasn’t happened for me yet. Some of the stupidest decisions in dating that I have made over the years (accepting poor treatment etc) is down to ‘how will I have a baby?’ I have now stopped looking for someone else to give me what I want, I am now saving and planning to actively pursue solo parenthood via IVF. But even then, it is no guarantee of motherhood. IVF is no given. I share many of your feelings - I feel invisible as a single, childless woman whilst mothers seem to be celebrated everywhere. The endless complaining about how hard motherhood is (however true), may be designed to make us feel better about our childless state, but it does the opposite and makes me feel more isolated.
Isabel, thank you so much for your lovely comment. I'm so glad it resonated with you. That's also the part I find the most isolating. For some reason mums celebrating and sharing their joy doesn't bother me as much. I am also saving to do the same by the way. I hope it works out for both of us xx
Thanks for opening up this topic Nicola, I love and admire your openness and honesty. YES pls let’s build a bridge and support each other wherever you find yourself. As you know I’m a Christian and one of my favourite scriptures in the Bible is Romans 12:15 which reads: “Be happy with those who are happy, and weep with those who weep.” It’s a hard call to put aside our own immediate feelings to be empathetic to another but it’s also a key part - in my opinion - of being human. I had an abortion when I was 18 and then lost my daughter to early infant death when I was married a few years later. It took me ages to even look at another baby but the healing began when a toddler thrust her arms out at me so I had no choice but to carry her. Like you, babies and young children melt my heart. Now that I’m divorced and single again I’ve taken children out of the equation but him grateful that I feel okay about that because I know that feeling of want is realllllly f-cking hard. I pray for people who want to be pregnant and I pray for people who have experienced baby loss like me. It feels like a gift to be in this place of healing.
Ah Tola! Thanks so much for your lovely comment! You are amazing. I meant to say your newsletter on abortion was really good - so honest and a really important topic. Thanks so much for your kind words. I'm so glad you are in a place of healing. You deserve it! I owe you an email by the way xxx
It always hits me when reading articles people write about their lives, experiences and feelings, then reading the comments these articles generate, that the shared thread is often that at times there is a feeling of being misunderstood, alone, invisible or overlooked. Maybe that could be the beginning of the bridge? The realisation that despite how varied and different our lives, experiences and feelings are, that within those, nearly all of us will have felt misunderstood, alone, invisible or overlooked somehow. That the anger, sadness/pain, shame/guilt and contradictory emotions we can all have, regardless of what our lives look like to the outside world/others, are natural and we should try to understand that more. Not just understand the people with whom we share some identified similarities with, but also those whose lives look totally different to ours, but who still have those feelings about their situations etc?
Just think there are the childless by choice, those who wanted children but couldn't,
those who had children who died, women who were pregnant but lost the baby, those who had abortions, those who gave children away for adoption, or had their children removed by Authorities. Grandparents, other relatives or friends of the parents raising children. There are only children or multiple children in a home, single mothers, same sex couples raising children, married parents, divorced parents, step parents, surrogate mothers, adoptive parents, foster parents and of course parents who don't want to be! There are parents with disabilities raising children without disabilities, or parents who have children with disabilities who do not have disabilities themselves. There are couples parenting children who are mixed heritage either together or alone, with either disapproval from the other's family due to ethnicity difference or with support.
There are so many 'parenting' roles, biological or otherwise. Professionally there are jobs where you can take on a role where you care very much like a parent does.
Each unique experience comes with those feelings of being misunderstood, alone, being invisible or overlooked. All are different, none are better.
Thanks so much for your brilliant response.
I love this: "The realisation that despite how varied and different our lives, experiences and feelings are, that within those, nearly all of us will have felt misunderstood, alone, invisible or overlooked somehow. That the anger, sadness/pain, shame/guilt and contradictory emotions we can all have, regardless of what our lives look like to the outside world/others, are natural and we should try to understand that more."
I so agree! Thanks again for taking the time to comment. xxx
I agree most of society feel misunderstood, isolated, alone, invisible or overlooked at some point in our lives, so that is a great starting point. Yet there seems to be low understanding and empathy around being without child for both men and women for whatever reason in comparison to other circumstances that cause a grief response. There is a proactive outpouring of sympathy to the loss of .... yet those without child grieve alone ashamed somehow of their failure to fulfil the role of mother/father with the added expectation that they had a choice to adopt, IVF, surrogacy etc so the blame lays at our door. How can we expect understanding when there is no societally defined pain point that evokes an outpouring of support for our grief?
Thanks for this Nicola, great writing and i realted to it as someone who sits somewhere between childfree and childless, so in a different space to you. Not sure if that will change.
I find there's so many grey areas of feelings in an issue that is often painted as black and white. Some other weird trigger points I've come across in my journey with this:
- I feel like there is an implication if you don't have kids your career better be absolutely stellar to have any value as a single childless woman. My job is good and I value it, but I find more value in my hobbies and friendships.
- As IVF single motherhood had become more slightly common (and absolutely hooray for this for those people who want to do it) there's also a little bit of judgement if that's NOT your choice if you technically COULD do it, albeit with much sacrifice. I just resent being told to take this path by people with twice the income and more resources than me, like it's like it's an easy solution or decision.
Just my thoughts incase someone else relates.
Hi Kirsten,
Thanks so much for sharing this! I love what you have said about your career and how actually your hobbies and friendships are what you value the most. I've been writing something recently about being called a career woman and this has just made me think about how it's also the pressure, like you say, to have a stellar one! Thank you for raising such a good point.
Also, I totally hear you on the solo motherhood journey. It really isn't for everyone and is so so so expensive. If it was easy / cheap, I would have done it years ago as for me I can see myself doing it... but it's neither so I have just been hoping to find a way. It is really annoying when people just say "go for it" without appreciating the scale of the financial implications etc. Also some people simply don't want to as they only want kids if they can do it with a partner which is also more than fair enough!
Thanks again for sharing xxxx
It's exhausting being a woman isn't it! It just feels like you can't win. Love both Clover Stroud and Elizabeth Day - both experiences totally valid and worthy of attention. But given that motherhood is still seen as the 'default', I still feel that single and childless women (whether by choice or not) are really stigmatised and excluded. I feel that Elizabeth really encapsulated the lack of empathy so many people have for something which for them, may have been relatively easy. I feel that all the time I am expected to be constantly empathetic to the struggles and experiences of friends who are partnered, but that same empathy is never available or reciprocated back to me, for what I may be struggling with. If it is, it's done in quite a dismissive, almost exasperated way. I wish more people could understand how it feels to not get the societal validation of hitting these milestones. It's obviously infuriating that men aren't treated the same way, or subject to such judgement! For what it's worth, I really recommend the book Between Women: Love, Envy, and Competition in Women's Friendships by psychologist Susie Orbach - the conclusion is that women really need each other, regardless of whether they are mothers or not!
Oooh that book sounds amazing. I am collecting non-fiction books about friendship at the moment. Thanks so much for your lovely comment and yes it really is exhausting! I totally relate on feeling like people are exasperated with me over things I struggle with! Thanks again Charlie xx
Woah! Sorry didn’t expect that to be so long! Guess this is a matter closer to my heart than I realised! But basically, yes to women supporting women. Hands down the best way forward 🙏🏾🫶🏾💪🏾 xx
This resonates with me on so many levels.
I’m 43 and have/ am coming to terms with the fact that the having children ship has sailed without me.
It was hard enough for years being the only single one amongst friendship groups, but being the only one who is single AND childless for the last 5-10 years has been pretty isolating. Being made to feel by some people as inadequate because of the fact that your life hasn’t followed the “traditional” path of find boyfriend, get married, have kids is hard.
Even though close friends try to be sympathetic, I don’t think they understand how hard it is that I’ll never be a mother - because they all are. It probably doesn’t help that I’ve made light over the years of how I feel because 1) no one wants to spend time with a whiner who makes them feel bad that they have kids, and 2) I also don’t want people pitying me.
It’s a tough situation and maybe I need to spend more time making friends who are in similar situation.
Thanks so much for the comment, Louise. I'm so sorry you have had to come to terms with that. That's so hard – and you're right being the only one who is both single and childless can be so isolating.
I so relate to what you said about making light of the situation. I definitely used to do that a lot. I've actually had quite a few messages from people I know who have said they had no idea I wanted to be a mum, which goes to show how good I used to be at masking. It's only really in the last two years that I've taken the mask off but like you I also still make light of it often for fear of no-one wanting to hang out with me.
Sending love
Xxx
This is a subject I have thought about often. Thank you so much for writing about it!
Nicola, what a powerful read. Thank you for sharing so honestly. I don't feel entitled to comment on the experiences of childless women, whether by choice or not, because I do have children. In this space, that feels like a confession. I agree with you and Elizabeth Day in that that surely, like anything else, really *really* listening to each other is the way to bridge any gap? And caring deeply about the experiences of our friends, whether they are feeling joyful, deep in grief, envious, or whatever. I hope to be that kind of friend - indeed I hope I AM that kind of friend.
From my perspective, I have been told not to breastfeed in public in case it might upset a bystander who doesn't have children. I've been deliberately excluded from a birthday dinner for a friend, because they assumed I wouldn't be able to find a babysitter. I don't share celebrations of motherhood on my social media, but I agree with you that I don't think this is akin to showing off a fancy car. This is my life, my family, and I feel I should be able to choose to share some of it.
I do understand the other point of view and I have been in that position - unceremoniously handed a newborn three days after a miscarriage, and ushered upstairs to read bedtime stories to children when I was quite enjoying being childless and drinking wine with the adults. It's such a difficult subject to tackle but I think communication is key. Anyone who doesn't want to listen to your point of view, whatever it is, is not worth the time. x
You are definitely welcome to comment! I actually meant to put a note asking both mothers and childless women to comment.
I once didn't invite my friend with a five month old baby to the pub. I'd just assumed she would say no and that it would be annoying to be asked ("of course I can't come, I've got a new born, I imagined she would say). But she messaged the next day saying she was hurt to be left out and so I realised I should never assume. It was a big lesson for me although sometimes when I have invited mums to things they have responded with exasperation at being asked! I guess it goes back to everyone being different.
I'm sorry about the breastfeeding in public. That's so shocking! And about the miscarriage. I'm so sorry you went through that and were treated insensitively afterwards. Sending love xx
Anyway thanks so much for your thoughtful message. I really appreciate you joining the conversation.
xxx
Thanks Nicola. I loved your piece and it seems like you're someone full of empathy - Jan x
Such a great piece, thank you Nicola! x
Thanks Laura! xxx
What a well-written, thought-provoking article! Thank you, Nicola. We finally accepted I could not have children when partway through IVF my hormones dropped to a level which meant my reproductive system was no longer viable. After 16 operations for endometriosis my body could not take any more.
For years I had cooed over everyone's babies, played with toddlers, helped kids of friends with their homework - partly out of love and partly out of a need for that kind of connection, always anticipating. When I found out I could not have babies in any way naturally it was like a switch flipped. Every time a friend shared the wonderful news of their babies-to-be I smiled and hugged them, then cried for days at the unfairness of it all. It hurt SO much.
I withdrew from spending time off my own initiative with small people. It felt like sticking pins in my heart. And it wasn't healthy. I love all the kids I have known for decades (no longer kids, obviously) and would literally give a kidney for them. But now I steer clear of most children, apart from two gorgeous redheads to whom I am godparent. With them I have a place. A function. A purpose.
The next stage I dread is when the friends I socialise become grandparents and I feel excluded again. I'm trying not to think of that.
Oh Lisa. Thanks so much for sharing this with me. I'm so sorry you have been through all this.
And thanks for sharing how it's been to be around babies and small children. That sounds so tough. It really is so unfair. But putting those boundaries in place and taking care of your own needs was obviously the right thing to do. I love what you said about your godsons giving you a place, a function and a purpose when it comes to kids.
Have you heard of Gateway Women? Jody Day is the founder and she's also written a book about living a fulfilled life after coming to the same conclusion you did. I interviewed her recently and she was brilliant. Some of what you have said reminds me of how she felt and feels.
Anyway, sending lots of love xxx
I'm glad you're using your platform to highlight this. Disability is another angle to this which is seldom explored. Substack just ate my entire attempt at a comment, so let's try again:
I personally feel ambivalently childless. I was always afraid of pregnancy and labour, and as my multiple serious chronic conditions developed through my teens, I could see how a pregnancy might destabilise my health, and that having little social or financial support would make motherhood harder given my relapsing/remitting illness. I believed I wouldn't be allowed to adopt.
I sum it up as "I would have liked to have had a genuine choice." In an ableist world where we face all sorts of extra structural inequalities, you can easily wind up adapting your appetite to life for the scraps available, and only in middle age have I been able to see how damaging that has been for me. Nobody back then was teaching me about disability justice or intersectional feminism.
Society's largely unexamined ableism shapes perceptions of our bodies and lives. Either we are seen as needing to make up for our supposed deficits by reproducing, or we face shaming, disapproval and concern-trolling for wanting to - including sometimes by doctors.
If you're autistic the knives are out for you either way. Childless? You risk vicious attacks if you speak up about the needs and experiences of autistic children (which you "know nothing about" despite having BEEN one). The mother of an also autistic child? You risk hostility when you advocate for them in medical and educational settings, because the very source of your deep insight into their experience gives authorities permission to dismiss you.
The fear of disabled bodies is immense at the best of times, and the cycle of austerity, pandemic and now more welfare reforms shows that disabled lives are still considered disposable. In that context, disabled motherhood and disabled childlessness are both intensely political, routinely invisible, and in conversations like this one, often forgotten altogether.
Thanks so much for this thoughtful and interesting response. You are right about disability being another angle that's ignored. I should have mentioned disability in my piece. I'll make sure I include some links to articles when I get round to doing a follow up. I can also commission a disabled writer to do a guest piece for me.
This paragraph stood out as I've been thinking about this lately: "Society's largely unexamined ableism shapes perceptions of our bodies and lives. Either we are seen as needing to make up for our supposed deficits by reproducing, or we face shaming, disapproval and concern-trolling for wanting to - including sometimes by doctors."
I follow a woman on Instagram who is disabled and uses a wheelchair. She recently gave birth to a baby but while pregnant, she faced so many insensitive questions and so much judgement and so much shaming. The baby is healthy and things went smoothly but it hasn't stopped the naysayers. But despite this I can see how much it has meant to people to see her share her experience honestly because we don't usually see that representation. Hopefully it will help people confront some of their own biases. Obviously the trolls are too far gone.
Anyway thanks again for taking the time to write. Xxx
That's really interesting, and I think situations like that woman's experience also inadvertently highlights the limits of disability inspo (as ever, Stella Young is relevant: https://www.ted.com/talks/stella_young_i_m_not_your_inspiration_thank_you_very_much?language=en).
People often want to watch us do amazing feats and come away thinking, "Well, if she can climb a mountain with multiple disabilities, I can get that promotion this year," - or whatever goal you're having doubts or impostor syndrome about.
But when we invite others into our normal, like being a disabled mum, it can provoke unease because it takes us off the inspo pedestal. And all that inspo hasn't prepared anyone to examine structural or personal ableism, which then gets couched as concern for the child. I think you can cop a lot of flak when you're the first disabled mum people are aware of having encounered.
But she and people like Jessica Kellgren-Fozard and Hannah Witton are doing an enormous amount to shift the ground on this topic - just seeing Jessica discuss adaptive childcare as a Deaf (and gay) mum with disabilities affecting fatigue, pain and muscle tone, or Hannah talking about how pregnancy changed her experiences with her stoma, is widening the conversation in ways it's really needed, and I'm so glad to hear you're also interested in platforming disabled writers on this topic.
Thanks for a really interesting and valuable conversation!
Thanks for writing this. It articulates many of my feelings so well! I’d love to be a mother and had just started exploring options for single women when I got me/cfs. Not being able to work and the prospect of a precarious life on inadequate income support is bleak, but not as heart breaking as how less likely it now is that I’ll ever have a baby. I nearly cried at lunch for my sister’s birthday yesterday when a waitress asked if I wanted to see the kids menu, as if one of the kids were mine. Big love to anyone struggling with motherhood or it’s lack.
Hi Cat, I'm so sorry. That's so hard. Thanks for sharing though. It's an important perspective. Sending you so much love xxxx
Dear Nicola, I am responding from the permanently childless perspective. I am somewhere in between childless by choice and not by choice, i.e. I identify as ambivalently childless. I hear you that you wish you were ambivalent! I am 46, have been single for over ten years, and this is pretty much why I'm childless. I don't expect that to change and am trying to make peace with it.
I liked so many things about this piece. I really wanted to post it on Lighthouse Women, an international community of childless women I'm sure you're familiar with. But I won't post it there (maybe someone else will) because I find a couple of aspects of what you wrote insensitive to the permanently childless experience.
I know that when it comes to parenthood, you still identify as hopeful. You don't identify as permanently childless like I (and all Lighthouse Women) do; you are still in the unknown of whether you will or won't be a parent. I am mentioning this because when I was still in the unknown, I also didn't mind being around other people's children or seeing people celebrate mother's day. I was still hopeful that I might one day join the ranks of parents with children; other people's babies and mother's day celebrations reminded me of what was hopefully in my future.
This all changed when I became permanently childless. It was about two years ago; I was almost 45 and realized with sudden clarity that it just wasn't going to happen. There was some relief in finally knowing. And it also really changed how I felt about being around moms and children (particularly strangers) and mother's day celebrations. I still love babies, though I haven't held one since I became childless, but I am now happiest when I am not confronted with moms and babies because they fill me with mostly shame and also some pain. And I am ambivalently childless - I know that the pain is much more severe for those who are unequivocally childless not by choice.
So here is what made me protest on the inside while reading your piece and compelled me to respond for the first time after having been reading The Single Supplement for over a year:
"But as I said I didn’t see trigger warnings or apologies – and women really shouldn’t have to feel the need to apologies for celebrating motherhood. That, I feel, is totally unnecessary." I agree with you that no one should have to apologize for celebrating mother's day. And I think trigger warnings and opt-outs are absolutely essential for those grieving their childlessness. More and more companies are offering opt-outs from mother's day mailings. Mother's day can be excruciatingly painful for those who wanted to be mothers but aren't and won't be. I feel protective of these women when I see you defending mothers' rights to amplify themselves on mother's day. I really don't want to contribute to the "us vs them" mentality you speak to. And yet--and this brings me to my second point..
You ask: "Couldn’t we build a bridge and focus on what we do have in common and focus on the ways in which we could hold space for both experiences?" That sounds great. I would love that. And yet, the space for the motherhood experience already exists. It is literally everywhere. You are right that mothers are not invisible - childless women are. Mothers are in the majority; childless women are a minority, a marginalized community. Just look at any contemporary TV show: All the supposedly relatable female characters over 40 are parents. It is the space for the childless experience that still needs to be created. So it feels a little unfair that you are holding all women equally responsible for creating equity when we are not currently seen or treated as equals.
Hi Vera,
Thanks so much for your thoughtful response and so sorry you found my writing insensitive. I should have mentioned people who are permanently childless. That was an oversight, which was perhaps down to the fact I sometimes find it a difficult idea to confront as I know it could be my future and I'm not ready to give up hope yet. Perhaps I can commission a writer who is permanently childless – and also single – to do a guest piece from this perspective.
I'm sorry to hear you don't want to be around mothers and babies. I can understand that but I wasn't saying that Elizabeth or anyone who feels this way was wrong. I was just sharing my own perspective so I don't think that was actually insensitive? It's just how I feel not a judgement.
I take your point about trigger warnings, obviously everyone is different. I can edit in and add a line to say that but just to be clear when I was talking about trigger warnings, I wasn't talking about businesses and companies. I was talking about individual mums doing trigger warnings on their own Mother's Day posts. Perhaps I should make that clearer. I think the opt out option for emails etc is really good and I have friends who use it because they have lost one or both parent.
I understand on your last point. I didn't think of it like that at all but you make a great point. Thanks for sharing. Sorry again you felt it was insensitive xx
Hi Nicola, it is late and I will write more tomorrow. I just wanted to say that I found most of this article very sensitive! You bring up some really important and valid points that make me feel seen as a single and as a childless woman. Thank you for acknowledging also that you may have a blind spot around the permanently childless experience. It is scary to include it in one’s vision and I avoided it for a long time until I felt I couldn’t anymore. Time for sleep - more tomorrow. Thank you for being willing to be in dialog!
Hello again, I'm back. I wanted to respond to some of your positions.
1) Whether you suggested that the way Elizabeth (ED) feels is wrong: You definitely didn't say that explicitly. And the direct contrast of your feelings about holding babies with hers comes across as a subtle judgment or at least a lack of understanding for her. It sounded a bit like you were saying "what's the big deal; babies are great." What would have been more sensitive in my opinion is some understanding and empathy that permanently childless women in the depth of grief might feel uncomfortable around or might want to avoid moms and babies. I get where ED is coming from. Many people don't though, and so I will fill in the gap by normalizing this phenomenon: It is very common and understandable for childless women to need to set boundaries around moms and / or children for a time, and this phase can last months or even years. It doesn't constitute a moral failing on their part or mean that they are intolerant or unkind. I know that you didn't suggest any such thing but it felt important to me to emphasize this anyway because people might be tempted to judge childless women who need to protect themselves in this way as bitter or any other unflattering designations.
2) Mother's Day messages by companies vs individuals: It kind of felt like you were saying that it was a good thing that you didn't come across any apologies or trigger warnings on Mother's Day. To me, apologies isn't actually the right word because no one did anything wrong by having a baby. Acknowledgments feels more fitting. I agree that individual moms don't need to issue acknowledgments or trigger warnings on Mother's Day. But if they do, you bet that I and many other childless women will appreciate it. To me, it's an act of kindness and inclusion of childless women to acknowledge that Mother's Day might be an excruciating day of grief for some. Your message to moms seems to be "Don't worry about childless women on mother's day." I'm not saying that they need to (think of us) but you saying that they shouldn't feels insensitive to me. We're already excluded and invisibilized enough because moms are seen as more important and worthy of attention and space every other day of the year as well.
3) About my last point: It seems like you get it already but I wanted to share a little more. When I read ED's piece as a permanently childless woman, my response was a resounding YES. I don't share all of her experiences or perspectives but I felt supported in everything she said. I know that in your piece you tried to be neutral and inclusive of both mothers as well as childless women. Given that parenthood is the societal default and childlessness is seen as "other", i.e. parents are in the majority whereas childless women are a minority, I don't even know what neutrality would look like. And I am definitely sensing some subtle bias from you by way of privileging the comfort of mothers over that of childless women. If you are still hopeful of one day joining the mom club, it makes all kinds of sense. When I was still hopeful, I tried to ingratiate myself to moms, trying to be seen as "right" and "good" by them, as mom material, if you will. Now that I know for sure that I will never be part of the club, I am much less inclined to try to ingratiate myself or to be as polite as I once was, and the same seems to be true for ED. You could say that we are being harsh or abrasive or too loud but I just don't really see a lot of moms putting as much emotional labor into their relationships with childless women as vice versa. And this is why the process of building the bridge you are envisioning--which I would also love to see--is currently out of balance and one-sided.
All of this being said, I have so much empathy for your howamigoingtohaveababy soundtrack and the associated fear and panic. I admire you for speaking so openly about your hopes and pains. I get that no one wants to be a member of the childless-not-by-choice club. And this is exactly why permanently childless women often aren't treated very well - we remind people of what they don't want to be.
Thanks Vera. I appreciate your point of view although I don't agree with everything you have said and I think in some cases you are ignoring things I have actually said and reading lots of things into it that I don't actually think, which feels a bit unfair.
1) Me pointing out how I feel compared to ED was in no way a judgement at all. That didn't cross my mind for an instant. I was actually really moved by what she said and I know people who feel exactly like that. I was just trying to point out that everyone is different and everyone reacts differently. I used the word "movingly" and then I later said "But I haven’t been through a miscarriage or failed IVF so maybe it’s different for me. I know plenty of women who really struggle with being around pregnant women and babies and who dread being invited to baby showers. And they are also the ones to find Mother’s Day particularly challenging." I'm not sure what else I could have said here aside from not sharing my own experience. But this newsletter is based on my own personal stories – and lots of people have mentioned to me that they are the same as me around babies including some permanently childless (see Tola's message below).
2) I talk about acknowledgments and how much I appreciated them on Mother's Day. "What I had seen were some people choosing to add a little thoughtful note to say they were thinking of those struggling. I appreciated these little notes and didn’t think they took away from the celebration." and "I guess that is why when people have put a little note under posts about Mother’s Day to say they are thinking of those who are struggling, I have felt touched." What I said about Trigger Warnings and apologies was in direct response to Clover's post and all the comments underneath. I felt that doing a big post about trigger warnings was unnecessary as I didn't see any. That is what I meant by that. Again I was talking about individual mothers not businesses and I was talking about I had personally seen and my thoughts on what Clover's post said. You are also saying you appreciate acknowledgments so we literally are saying the same thing here. And on actual TW, I am also allowed my own opinion on them. It doesn't take away from anyone else having an opinion. I was writing from my own perspective.
3) The other point, I do understand and you have given me food for thought but I do think you're expecting an awful lot from me given it's my first contribution on the topic and I was sharing my opinion on what could help rather than proposing a detailed plan of what it could work... Also on this part - "And I am definitely sensing some subtle bias from you by way of privileging the comfort of mothers over that of childless women" – It's true, I didn't want to alienate anyone and that does include mothers but it was more because I know people just switch off if they feel like they are being shamed and I wanted to show empathy to them in much the same way as I was asking for it for women without kids. Maybe I am biased for the reasons you say but I did also say right at the top of the article that I was writing it from my perspective as a woman who wants a child and doesn't have one yet. I wasn't writing a balanced piece of journalism. It's a personal essay and it's my reality now. I can't pretend to be someone I'm not in order to keep everyone reading my work happy. Besides I've been contacted by other permanently childless women on Twitter and Instagram and it's clear that everyone feels differently so it would be impossible. But I do totally get and understand your point about the minority vs majority and how imbalanced that is and how it should be more on the heads of mothers. I wasn't claiming to be able to solve the problem though, I just wanted to start a dialogue and to try and get mums reading this to understand my position because a lot of them, as you know, do not really stop and think about it.
Thanks though for taking the time to write to me. I do appreciate your point of view and perspective and I will commission a writer to do something for the newsletter on the perspective of being permanently childless as soon as I can. Thanks again for your thoughts. Xx
Hi Nicola, I'm glad to hear that you aren't judging ED. I must have misunderstood.
Again, I appreciated so much of what you wrote here. Maybe I could have highlighted some of those aspects more. Here is just one example: "I once read somewhere that the only thing more exhausting than having children is not having children and wanting them." I think I have read that somewhere before as well, and it really resonates.
You are right that you cannot be someone you're not. I apologize if it seems like I am asking you to be someone else. My intention was to educate but it seems that I have put you on the defensive. I will back off now and look forward to reading more of your writing on the topic of childlessness.
Sorry Vera. I didn't mean to be defensive. I am just tired as I've have been replying to people all day on social media and via email. But I have just edited the piece and included a video by Jody Day, who I recently interviewed and a few other clarifications. Thanks again. xx
Hi Nicola, I hear you about being exhausted. It sounds like you really struck a chord! From what I can see on Substack, you got very positive responses. I hope you didn't get too many challenging responses elsewhere. I apologize if I was too hard on you. I have really enjoyed your contributions to the single space, and I knew that due to long-term singlehood you had lived experience of being othered and sidelined, so I was hoping you would be able to understand what I was saying. And it sounds like you did! I'm just sorry if I hurt you in the process - I really didn't meant to. I also realize now that there were at least two misunderstandings on my part:
1) I didn't realize that you were talking about the relationship between moms and temporarily childless women, i.e. potential future moms. It makes sense though since that's your identity. When you say "childless woman" you mean "still hopeful childless woman." When I read "childless woman" I think "permanently childless woman" because that's my identity now. So that's where my field of vision is limited and our wires got crossed a bit.
2) Even though I am familiar with your newsletter, I perhaps took this recent one to be more political than you meant it. And so I wanted it to be more politically correct, if you will. Even though I do believe that the personal is political, I understand now that in your writing you were speaking from your own personal experience and didn't really intend to speak for everyone, and certainly not all permanently childless women. And so again, our wires got crossed a bit, and I take responsibility for that.
I really do appreciate you making that edit though to include the permanently childless experience and the link to the video. And I am excited about your unpublished project involving Jody Day!
Yes! This! This was a beautiful read. I’ve never had even an inkling of desire to be a mother…until I met my current partner. Had we come together 10 years ago, I think we would have had children. (There is still a huge part of me that very much does not want to be a mother) It is not in the cards for us and I’m at peace with it.
It’s so disheartening the way women are pitted against one another based on our personal choices and our ability to reproduce. To me, being a mother is a sacred journey that I have the utmost respect for AND it doesn’t make you more worthy than someone who has made a different choice. I don’t feel less than for not choosing motherhood. Women who experience life without children have an enormous amount to offer the world, each other, and ourselves.
I’m very grateful that I have a wonderful mix of girlfriends who are both mothers and not mothers. We support one another and hold space for each of our unique choices/experiences in life. My hope is that more women experience this kind of acceptance and celebration of our personal choices.